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americans arent grateful enough
like yeah you keep saying "nono it sucks" but theres a lot of ppl that still want to come there (me)
i think thats a sign of a great country,no matter how shitty it is,its always better than a few countries (including turkey)
and no im not ignorant or anything,i know the issues there,but as they say; better than turkey!
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Oriphiel
Completely correct.
America has issues, but overall its great and well above average.
The problem comes from people like LEO in the comments here who id assume grew up in america, in total safety and without and real adversity in life. So instead of complaining about real issues that affect them as there are near none. they hyperfocus on whatever insane media talking point the news wants people to be upset about on any given day until they are filled with hatred for their home.
im sorry SOMEONE just had to say it
thank you internet person
surely you would be interested in this aswell?
https://blog.spacehey.com/entry?id=2016553
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
damn okay i got called out T_T
by LEO??; ; Report
im not in danger (im white) but one of my best friend's dad was deported and is being sent to a detention centre
literally all he did was go to the grocery store hello T_T
so yes while i do recognize that im problably just complaining, there are plenty of americans who face real danger every day because of trump
uhm like kids in minestota are like afraid to go to school because innocent civillians have been shot dead there by ice T_T
yes a lot of countries are terrible off and i understand that
AND its terrifying when it's your country which is why so many americans are freaking out so hard
by LEO??; ; Report
and also yeah i agree american media is insane T_T
its not america i hate, its the direction its going because yeah america's pretty rad under the right leaders..
look man a lot of the things the trump administration is doing right now dosent even seem real and people are just trying their best to cope
(sorry if i got a bit defensive i was trying to stay as constructive as possible (i love debating))
by LEO??; ; Report
holy yap okay ill shut up
by LEO??; ; Report
Plenty of criticism to go around for trump, hes not doing great imo. Economy is awful, gas prices high, more war after he promised no war, giving away tons of money to israel again, etc.
But alot of the criticisms are not valid either or at least are less valid than people make it seem. For your points, the people who got shot by ice were both filmed attacking law enforcement and generally acting like psychos. They shouldn't have been shot, we agree there. But its hard to act like they were completely innocent either, as they initiated the violent conflict in both cases.
And the deportations I empathize with, and it sucks. But also that is just the laws that have existed since before I was born being enforced.
I really think alot of it is just the media trying to spread hate and division because thats what makes them money, they literally write articles in ways to piss you off intentionally cause your more likely to read or share those.
by Oriphiel; ; Report
holdup lets take this to the IMs buddy
by LEO??; ; Report
lmk how it went
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
this is like saying that feminist in first world countries shouldn't focus on woman in third world countries because first world woman have it better and therefore should turn a blind eye to woman in third world countries,because it doesn't affect them. as if saying they are bored.
injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere
by Skuromi; ; Report
yeah
by LEO??; ; Report
so uhhh who r u agreeing with
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
imo people should be celebrating white men(mainly bc they hold the most "power" in society) when they talk abt stuff that affects their opposite counterparts like colored men and women, not because its just important but you have a louder voice then coloured people and woman combined; making people with louder voices feel ashamed while using them for good is wrong.
by Skuromi; ; Report
yeah I agree with this
I'm trans but I have passing privilege but I do know what not being a cis man is dw <3
by LEO??; ; Report
OHH dude thats cool asf anyways continue to stand up for what is right, dont let some weirdo discourage you from it js because its "not ur problem"
by Skuromi; ; Report
Kajtek
No disrespect or anything, but I'd like to know, why would you want to go to America? There is Europe just right across Turkish border – the standards of living in most countries are arguably as good or better than in the USA, and while some anti-immigration moods are rising, last time I checked no one is kidnapping people on the streets here.
language.
wont spawn in my head like english
sure im learning german but the only reason is that it would and i quote "look good on my resume"
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
nutbiscuits
I have a complex relationship with this take, personally. On the first hand, sure. The material conditions of the US populous are decreasing - that's a given. With state machinery such as ICE, the police, etc., we are also noticing an increase in authoritarian crackdowns in the US.
But, realistically speaking, the US working class is a much more "advanced" working class compared to many other nations. The US is the most influential dictatorship of capital in global history. We (yes, even the US populous as we are in direct support many times of US imperialist interests) outsource to other countries in the chase of maximizing our profits before the capitalist regime collapses in on itself, because capitalism is inherently an unstable system. But, the American people enjoy and satiate their needs from the spoils of imperial warfare. We, as the American working class, are comfy and privileged due to the laboring of the foreign working class. So, you are correct in your assessment that we have it better off than a lot of other countries... But that does not equate to gratefulness!
To be a bit more clear, my main point is that the American people should not be grateful for what they have because it comes from the direct exploitation of working class people across the world. People are beaten, exploited, and given scraps in order to support our style of living and prosperous industries in and out of America. When you live in a system that is directly responsible for a majority of foreign suffering, why should you be grateful to live in that system? What is to be done is to align yourself with the global working class against the capital owners with massive influence; it's not to say "we have it worse," but it's to say, "what our capitalist regime does is not right, and I will not support the cycle of imperialism our state continues to carry out."
I also wanted to address your assertion that it's a sign of a great country that "no matter how shitty it is, it is still better than other countries out there." It only exposes how that country is inherently unstable! A country is able to sustain itself on a scale that massive only through imperialism. The country doesn't act in the interests of the working class or the global working class, but it works in the interests of expanding capital and their spheres of influence. Let's also go through what makes a "great country." Is it the GDP? Is it how well it takes care of its citizens? Is it whether wages are stagnant or moving along with inflation? Well, I'd argue that the sign of a good country is one that isn't willing to exploit any group of people for profit. That is it. I make such a vague statement because it's easily applicable to a bunch of cases. Even in European social democracies, they still enjoy their privileges in healthcare and job security because of the exploitation of workers in Africa! In the US, we enjoy our "privileges" only because of our wide domination of capital on the global scale. It's also arguable that our "privileges" are just a smokescreen to give us the illusion that we have a choice or say in the matters that be, but that's an entirely different topic.
Bottom line, I do not believe that Americans should be grateful for what they have at all! They can view it from the very basic perspective that, "wow, I have all this great stuff." But that is it - because it's not worth having any of it at all if it's all from the backs of exploited workers experiencing wage slavery all across the world.
i do not care what the US does to sustain itself
all i know is; "its better than here so i shall seek a life there"
1 dollar is 44 kebab bucks and our "president" is trying to put sharia law over here
is that really better than late stage capitalism?
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
also thank you for wording it in such a way that i had to legit stare at this for 20 good minutes to understand anything
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
No need to be an asshole in your response. But either way, every country takes part in late-stage capitalism. It's not "better than" late-stage capitalism because it is late-stage capitalism. Any country can enact a capitalist state, it's simply a socioeconomic system. A capitalist state can also be a theocratic state, neither are contradictory. Look at Iran, for example.
Also, to make this short - the assertion that you "don't care" what the US does to sustain itself can be applied to anything. I don't want to use such an extreme example, but this same assertion could be applied to the Third Reich. The Nazis largely profited off of the forced labor of Jews and non-Aryan minorities in labor camps. Would you have cared that they did that in order to sustain the German economy? I'm sure you would have.
Also, also, I'm not trying to say that the Americans don't have a better life than you do in Turkey. The Americans have a higher standard of living than most of the world, but that doesn't mean you should be "grateful" for anything. Gratuity leads to stagnation in progress, and if we are to advance as humanity, all together, we must be against all of our oppressors.
by nutbiscuits; ; Report
Mr. KokoPudgeFudge
America is a nice country to live in, but I hate giving taxes to pedophiles.
i hate taxes in general
we are not the same
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
Nokia 6600
mama, oppression olympics again.
i'm turkish, i live in turkey (or turkiye, whatever, i'm used to saying turkey) and i do agree that our country also has a shit ton of problems. we also have a groomer in charge of this land. our economy is also shitty. our quality of life is also horrible. there's propaganda everywhere here too. i'll give you that.
but there's no point in pointing your finger at something which is clearly becoming a shithole as well and going "they're doing better than us!!". this does NOT help either party.
in fact the actual inequality comes from here: you're dividing folks by "us" and "them". this is what they want us to do already; do NOT give these manchildren who are supposed to be in prison an opportunity to divide us!!
we're going through tough times. we need to unite against propaganda. we need to unite against folks who put these morons into their thrones. we cannot change things for the good by pointing and telling people to be grateful; because THAT'S WHAT THEY WHO SHALL NOT BE NAMED WANT US TO DO.
aint nothing in this country worth dying for (anymore) im going either way
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
you do realize there's this group of thugs the US government feeds named ICE right? even if you were to visit the US, you would be in danger because you aren't "white".
even "white" folks get arrested and murdered for no reason at all by ICE. so i don't see why you would want to visit a country that tries to revive nazism.
also even if you did pass as "white", the economy is shitty out there. folks choose death over visiting the ER thanks to the health"care" system charging $300 for a fucking bandaid.
finally: please educate yourself and do some research, cuz it's obvious that you have no idea what the hell you're talking about.
by Nokia 6600; ; Report
solution: dont live in a blue state
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
let me repeat this again: educate yourself. you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.
by Nokia 6600; ; Report
are you a fed perhaps
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
brother wtf would i do with spacehey if i were a fed?? please use your brain for the sake of other folks' wellbeing.
by Nokia 6600; ; Report
whatevs bud IMs are open if you wanna take this further
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
nah fam, i've had my daily dose of incompetency. have a lovely rest of your day.
by Nokia 6600; ; Report
are you from sivas atleast
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
i'm not unfortunately. yine de leblebi diyarından selamlar (çorum) :)
by Nokia 6600; ; Report
ya bir sivaslı bulamadım yalnızım buralarda
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
cuaternaria
The United States consolidated all the power it has nowadays via imperialism. And will, as it always had done, seek resources from outside to feed itself. Such is the nature of an imperialistic state. And to do so, it will reoccur to every way of justifying and excusing itself it can find; cling to every singe thing it can to seem itself seem righteous, to hide its intentions; do everything possible to maintain its status of complete impenetrability.
The purpose of all of this, at the end of the day, is power. And to live in the imperial core not as an immigrant nor with a non-white status is an enormous privilege that people that do not have to fear persecution in the US (unlike immigrants or non-white people, especially Black and Native) should be thankful for and mindful of... Doing otherwise and acting as if you have it terrible is disrespectful and doesn't allow you to see beyond your privilege and helping others who don't have your luck.
at first i thought you disagreed
then i thought you agreed
idk which
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
I agree that USAmericans should be much more conscious of how they speak of their situation, after all, the world suffers for them to be able to maintain the imperial core.
by cuaternaria; ; Report
true true
they spew out these major problems (files,the war and allat)
but they never talk about how a day in their life goes like
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
exactly; all these are problems that are perfectly encouraged by their society, and yet they act as if they aren't; as if these are things others do, as if this isn't, essentially, their "America" in action.
by cuaternaria; ; Report
NO NO i meant like
their personal life is completely ok
so they feel the need to talk abt these problems because well "living here is fine" is boring according to them
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
mayonaise #dieharrd2day
yeah we’ve been knowing. wheres the actual hot take?
apparently it is a hot take
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
lau_e_tal
It's not a sign of a great country, it's a sign of great imperialist propaganda.
and its working /pos
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
mimi
tbf I agree wholeheartedly although its starting to suck for Americans too. with ICE situations and Trump existing, But I believe (this is my opinion im not diagreeing with your opninion on turkye because im not living in it) that living in a third world country is better MOST CASES NOT ALL i feel like people from third world countries have seen so much that they are wise from a young age. No hate to my American fellows but most of my experience with em online shows me how unaware and ignorant they are about THEIR OWN COUNTRY. and this isnt even about US bombing countries and striping them from their resources. But its basic moral stuff like:
"hey you shouldnt joke about the epstien files or send jeffery epstien stickers"
"this is how i cope :((("
like im sorry cope what exactly, you are in your comfort of your own room joking about a guy who traf**ed humans especially children
or to me its really ironic that i cant see americans who agree that maybe cops or ICE agents detaining and mistreating children and people is bad...? or that they arent enraged enough that their leader is IN THE FILES
my point is honestly every place on earth sucks every country every government sucks but i think id always choose to be born in the country im in because of the acts of humanity i see everyday and the culture and community that unites us (i believe this goes for anyone and you dont need to LOVE YOUR GOVERMENT ACTS to apreaciate your birth place)
I apologize for bad grammer!!
LEO??
NAHANAHAHANANAHAHnh im going to keep on posting lengthy comments on political stuff until i feel my need is satisfied im sorry lol
but yeah, countries are getting bombed, have full-on authoritarian governments and are systematically opressed. america is none of those things (yet on the authoritarian one)
AND two things can be bad at once. america has a long history of people not liking how things are going, protesting and fighting for a better life, it goes the people's way and we go onto the next problem. thats how you MAKE a great country like america. and currently, with the homophobic, transphobic, racist, sexist, anti-pagan, anti-muslim and anti-jewish things our own government is saying (when our first amendment is freedom of religion, expression and speech) is absolutley terrifying. two things can be bad at once. The direction Turkey is going in can also be terrifying. we can be terrified together (<3). but would you say that in the 70's, women were being ungreatful and shit?? NO?? would you say african slaves were being too unruly and disrespectful for wanting to be free?? NO???
america IS privledged. and thats because we've fought out way to that point. we went from being systematically stripped of our wealth, terrible to people who werent white males, and no hope, to AMERICA. we've seen authoritarianism in other countries, a big example is nazi germany in WWII. but we also see it in current countries and dont want it for ourselves.
and yes, being a white male, i am most likely safe. but just because something dosent affect me personally, dosent mean i shouldnt care about it?? as i said before, my best friend's dad got deported recently for picking up groceries. he dosent have a criminal record, he is a US citizen, and he still got plucked up off the streets for being a Mexican immigrant. he's currently being sent to a detention center. if you look it up, the things they do to the people there is just like a concentration camp.
what im saying is that this is happening to real people. not just numbers or headlines. i knew this man, he's literally an amazing father of 3, his family is very close to and loves him. these thousands of people are all REAL people who are in these places RIGHT NOW.
when a government makes children afraid to go to school, that's fucking crazy. a little like whats been happening in countries in the middle east. (look at ice in minesota.)
when a government labels all who try to oppose them as 'domestic terrorist', thats fucking crazy. like what's happening in a lot of countries.
when a government has a CHILD RAPIST, a man who SEX TRAFFICKED CHILDREN and dosent give any of them charges, THATS FUCKING CRAZY.
it's not mean or terrible or un-aware to be mad at a government for doing that. that's wanting what's best for everyone.
yknow europe aint any better
they already have a lot of arabs coming illegally
even if i go to germany legally id still get the same treatment
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
at least they dont send them to fucking torture prisons
by LEO??; ; Report
LEO??
okay Im hearing you out, and yeah America is a lot better than a lot of countries
BUT WERE LITERALLY BECOMING NAZI AMERICA WTH
like we're shooting journalists for recording ice... erm...
also our president is a child rapist and literally doing everything in his power to distract (starting wars, outrage, ect)
erdogan is turning us into a third world arab country
and yes i pulled the "better than turkey" card again sry
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
yeah then def get out of turkey (sad, my mom always talks about how great it was in the 90's or sum)
but maybe consider other options broski bc yeah I agree that Americans are usually kinda ungrateful (I'm also part of the problem tbh) but yeah I don't know anything about it but New Zealand looks (or looked) okay (my parents considered moving there when trump was first elected)
I don't know how any of these countries are doing but like Australia, (I know you don't want to live near britan), maybe a cheaper European country, ect ect
i know that Americans can be a bit dramatic but if almost every American you ask says it isn't looking good then that prolly means smth yk
and with trump the economy is kinda very slowly declining/will in the fear future
by LEO??; ; Report
brick
there is no heaven on the earth.
i proudly prefer living in my third world country Brasil, than going to the heart of the capitalism. imagine getting in debt just for being sick.
yeah bro fr
by LEO??; ; Report
i dont think third world countries are better
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
khek0_:3
Extremely valid take, as someone living in a third world country I'd do anything to be able to live in another continent far away from here
꩜ .ᐟ𝔀oliwag ⋆.˚𖦹
like leo said, the grass is always greener on the other side. i'll trade you countries!
pretty sure the grass aint green here cause erdogan is trying his best to implement sharia law
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
leo
bro you should be grateful for living in turkey 'cause i live in russia and it sucks. On the other hand i should be grateful too 'cause there're people living in India or Bangladesh. The grass is always greener, my friend. Except for people in Scandinavian countries, 'cause those are the best
i think turkey and russia are in the same boat
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
toot toot
I guess....?
youre lucky to be in europe raghhhhhh
by AmbitiousCat; ; Report
yet ppl in Ireland are still pissy.
by toot toot; ; Report