Snuff films - real or myth? [My thoughts]

Disclaimer: Since it's been proven some people can't understand age limits on my blogs based on the title - mature audiences only!

To address this entry further, it's not meant to "scare" anyone or anything like that. It's just my collection of thoughts about the topic.

Trigger Warning: Mentions of death, murder, suicide, gore in general, CESM, SA and (possibly) more.

What's snuff film?

I think starting with definition of what I'm talking about is important, so what's snuff film?

Snuff film has footage of a real life murder in it. Snuff is a murder captured on camera, filmed intentionally for distribution resulting in profit.

As of now, snuff is understood as urban legend without proof of its existence. But just because there's no proof, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Some people argue that rape videos (not ending with murder) are snuff, however that stance is rare (and incorrect), if we're following that logic - snuff is real and already proven.

So, just to clarify for people with that stance: for this entry I'm classifying as snuff only videos with real murder that are being distributed and sold, no matter the scale.

People and their stance.

There's three stances about snuff films:

• Complete denial about their existence
• They could be real, could be not
• They're real

I'd say majority is in either gray area or believes in their existence. Deniers are the smallest group. If not, then maybe it's somewhat equal proportions. I'm not 100% sure though. It's hard to find a chart or survey about it.

Why I'm a believer and gore sites.

My main argument is the fact it's not your average urban legend about ghosts, it's pure human degeneracy.

People think snuff films have to be lengthy with big industry behind them - that's just not true. A five second clip behind a paywall is enough to be snuff.

Or murder is some line people wouldn't dare to cross. I wouldn't say so. People have crossed so many lines on film already. Rape and CESM videos are being distributed, sold, filmed just for entertainment. There's a market for it. Supposedly nothing that should be happening, lines no one would cross, yet here we are.

So really, is murder the line?

People online profit off human suffering and/or death already. Take gore sites for example. A user might not profit, but the creator and funders of the site? There are ads (mostly porn since gore sites are controversial to partner with), paid to be shown or creators asking for donations to keep the servers running, maybe from just traffic alone. 

Now, you might be questioning, isn't it snuff? They're profiting off it? No, it's not. Most of the gore content is from accidents or surveillance cameras. There's war footage too, or terrorist attacks, but it's not filmed for profit or entertainment, it's propaganda or ideological. How about suicide videos? That's.. suicide. Not murder. Therefore, not snuff.

If it's not clear enough:

Not intentionally filmed = not snuff

Not filmed for profit = not snuff

There's no intentional murder within it = not snuff

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Proof of potential market.

There's argument that no one wants to see or buy it. As I stated above, gore sites exist. People are willingly seeking out gore, posting it and donating for the sites continuing to function. There's clearly people who would buy it, whenever they're curious or into it.

If you think "well, that's unlikely someone would actually promote gore!" - you're wrong again. A while back, unsure if it's still going on as I've uninstalled TikTok, there was a trend of putting an AI filter over gore videos: beheadings, shootings, terrorist attacks, etc. mainly for the algorithm to not take them down. The purpose of the video? Promote a telegram group. Sure, some have been posted just to shock people, but in majority you will find a telegram group link in the comments.

I DO NOT ENCOURAGE LOOKING FOR IT! 

In such group there's an average of hundreds of people posting uncensored gore or, to some extent, illegal content. So people do promote gore.

Where it might happen?

Again - telegram. It's a perfect place for such content to bloom. The app has passive/reactive moderation and little to no verification.

Telegram is famous for it's "free speech" creator. Problem is that his free speech policy created an app where criminal groups - like cartels - can organize. What you need to make an account is only a phone number (I don't have a telegram account so correct me if I'm wrong) that they don't even verify is yours, just that it exists. You can have telegram for a burner phone without any problem. Groups don't really have a limit how many people can join, and there's secret groups too - ones with full encryption. It's very private, so if you don't want your number visible, it's no problem.

I've already touched on moderation, but to explain further - on SpaceHey we have an active moderation. There's people checking every report, even (I assume) browsing through blogs sometimes. On telegram the moderation doesn't do much. They're there, but there's much more users than what they can handle, and they don't check many reports either. They take action only when one post has many, and I mean many, reports. If it got a few thousands, they might take action.

Telegram has a history of terrorist planning attacks on it too, although, as far as I know, they (reluctantly) collaborated with local organs to stop them.

Given everything what was stated, it's unlikely someone posting snuff on telegram would get reported to authorities or their messages taken down.

Why?

Because people would want to see it. It's enough for a person to join a group and send a message with a link leading to a video behind a paywall. Someone will pay and no one would likely report it. If you're in that group, you're interested in gore (like it or are curious). If it gets reported, it's probably not sufficient amount for the moderation to even look at it. Besides, would you report a creator of content you enjoy?

You might think it's different because it's actual murder. Let's ignore the fact gore videos already have murder in them for a moment. What's the effect of gore? Desensitization of people to violence, that's (one of) the reason(s) gore sites are controversial. So you might be disturbed at the thought, but people who consume gore - not necessarily.

Also, there's possibility of people thinking it's fake, very convincing edit or AI. People in 1976 were able to make a convincing murder scene, so in our day and age it's only easier. AI, deepfakes, even CGI blurred the lines between what's real or not.

Of course, I'm not saying every gore enjoyer won't report it, just that in spaces where gore is heavily normalized the lines can get blurry and many scientific papers link gore consumption to desensitization.

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No proof, why?

In my mind lack of proof is a direct result of the term "snuff film" not being legally recognized in court, it's too ambiguous and leaves too much to interpretation.

Another factor is moral panic it would bring. People deny existence of snuff because it's easier to deny than accept degeneracy and backwards morals in people.

So, even if someone done everything by definition of snuff film - you wouldn't hear "snuff" in court. What you would hear is breaking multiple existing laws, for example: murder and distribution of illegal/obscure material.

Some people online will say it is snuff, some will say it's not and make some excuse why it's not. And that's normal, expected and understandable.

Isn't it what happened with Peter Scully? (PLEASE don't read his case if you're easily disturbed - his case is full of pedophilia, CESM, abuse and torture. It's really gross (really, it's better to stay curious on that one)). After being proven on trial that he filmed a murder on camera (which has not been up for sale but putting what he had sold before I think we can assume he'd sell it if someone asks), people haven't acknowledged it, still think it's not real.

Skepticism about it's existence.

People also say that's too much risk. They look at the contract and think the reward isn't proportional to the risk the person takes. I think just because the risk might make it not worthy, it wouldn't make someone degenerate enough turn away from the idea. People already do, film and sell materials that aren't as rewarding as they are risky.

Or the fact people talk so much about dark web. There's rumors of videos like that being hosted there. But still, a verified case of commercial snuff films haven't come to the surface.

Years, even decades, of rumors and whispers about snuff films - yet no evidence. There's nothing.

All of these reasons are why people don't think it's real.

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What I'm saying?

While I'm a believer of snuff existing, I'm not saying saying you have to be one too. It's more about people not realizing there's possibility of it existing. I don't care if you're in a gray area, just if you're a straight up denier. There's market and there's a way. The hardest part about it would be covering up the crime (physical evidence, not digital), not finding people interested.

If anything what I've said is wrong or incoherent, correct me.

Source? I don't have a source. Why? Because - as the title said - those are my thoughts and reflection. Its purely based on what I think, saw, and heard.

The end.

And that's all from me. Hope you enjoyed reading, feel free to share your thoughts.

Post note:

I don't care if you're into gore or not, what you're doing or enjoy is your business only, just don't post it where there's no place for it (even if it's fake, people don't expect gore on site not made for it (although, I admit, some are really pushing it with how sensitive they are...))

Edit: Changed "After being proven on trial that he filmed a murder on camera for his movie, people haven't acknowledged it, still think it's not real and there's no cases. Sure, maybe it's one off, but still exists. How many we don't know about?" as I found it to be incorrect/misleading(?) I apologize for that - I've misunderstood the article I've read.

Edit 2: Some people brought up physical media and I totally see it used for that kind of thing! I didn't really think about it while writing this entry.